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RE:1 RE1 Remake: Which character?

mert20004

Mert_BIO_6
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Wanted to create this cause ı replayed the game today and the game is a classic and still aged well imo.

Which character do you prefer to play as more in remake?
 

Captain Redfield

The man who killed Albert Wesker
Chris, obviously. He has better knife skills capable of killing enemies in less than 10 slashes. He's better with firearms and you barely feel any recoil with him, particularly with the Magnum. Chris can also take more damage and insta-kill most enemies with the grenade.
Also, the Lab section with him fits the canon much better than Jill's, in Chris's ending Wesker gets impaled by the Tyrant as it is stated everywhere, whereas with Jill he gets slapped by the Tyrant and shot by Barry. As Wesker himself said in CODE: Veronica
"You have no idea how much I hate you... You destroyed my plans", this indicates that Chris clearly destroyed the Tyrant which was Wesker's offering to the Rival Company in exchange of a higher position from the get go and by destroying the Tyrant Chris screwed all of Wesker's plans that night... Well, along with Sergei as well haha

However, when doing my special RE1 playthrough I play as both because there is no RE1 with Chris and without Jill and vice-versa. Both characters should be played since they all have important info and scenes within them. It is just the Lab section that makes the most sense while playing as Chris and I usually ignore that section with Jill until the final battle and "imagine" both of them fighting the final boss with Chris blowing up the Tyrant.
 

Nero Sparda

Jack!POT!
Jill for me. She has more slots for her inventory, is master of unlocking, gets Grenade Launcher and has Barry as her backup. ( Rebecca is mostly useless. ) Not to mention; you can acquire Assault Shotgun from Richard earlier ( He also helps Jill earlier than he does to Chris. Poor guy, really wished RE0 focused a lot more on him and his team members. ) and you can skip Plant 42 boss fight completely.

Oh and Jill sandwich cutscene.

However, when doing my special RE1 playthrough I play as both because there is no RE1 with Chris and without Jill and vice-versa. Both characters should be played since they all have important info and scenes within them. It is just the Lab section that makes the most sense while playing as Chris and I usually ignore that section with Jill until the final battle and "imagine" both of them fighting the final boss with Chris blowing up the Tyrant.
I loved Remake but I really wished there was a special canonical scenario in the game that connected Chris' and Jill's scenarios to each other similar to RE2 and featured Barry and Rebecca together. This is a major reason why I prefer that game over Remake.

Also correct me if I'm wrong but wasn't it confirmed in RE3 that Jill was the one who blew up the Tyrant? I believe it was a file or something.
 

Captain Redfield

The man who killed Albert Wesker
Jill for me. She has more slots for her inventory, is master of unlocking, gets Grenade Launcher and has Barry as her backup. ( Rebecca is mostly useless. ) Not to mention; you can acquire Assault Shotgun from Richard earlier ( He also helps Jill earlier than he does to Chris. Poor guy, really wished RE0 focused a lot more on him and his team members. ) and you can skip Plant 42 boss fight completely.

Oh and Jill sandwich cutscene.


I loved Remake but I really wished there was a special canonical scenario in the game that connected Chris' and Jill's scenarios to each other similar to RE2 and featured Barry and Rebecca together. This is a major reason why I prefer that game over Remake.

Also correct me if I'm wrong but wasn't it confirmed in RE3 that Jill was the one who blew up the Tyrant? I believe it was a file or something.

But that's what makes Chris's story better to me, I like the challenge and the fact you barely receive any help. Oh... And Chris and Wesker team-up vs Lisa Trevor settles this lol

Nope, it wasn't confirmed anywhere that Jill blew up the Tyrant. They let that up to the player, same with RE2's ending regarding who faced the last form of G.
However a huge part of RE's storyline indirectly tells you who blew the thing up, which is Chris and Wesker's rivalry. If Chris wasn't the one then there would've been no point in this Chris and Wesker plot arc... Plus Wesker's dialogue from CODE: Veronica is the best piece of info you can get regarding who killed the Tyrant, therefore messing up Wesker's plans.
 

N7Valentine

It's my turn now, Bitch!
Jill, easily. Aside from the fact that she's my favorite, I also liked her playthrough storywise. Her interactions with Barry were great and I loved the story of Barry's family was held hostage by Umbrella and him being used by Wesker, which felt more connected than Chris' part, imo. Not to mention Jill's playthrough spawned iconic stuff like Master of Unlocking or Jill Sandwich
Rebecca and Chris were okay but nothing special. It's more of a "big tough guy protects cute girl" story. Too bad it didn't really connect to ZERO because of Rebecca and in REmake she's quiet about it, which makes no sense because she knows stuff and that in turn makes ZERO looking like an afterthought.

The help Jill gets is optional. One doesn't have to receive it. It's the same as helping Chris when he's poisoned. I personally prefer to take down Plant 42 myself ;) I honestly don't think Chris' part is actually hard.

Also correct me if I'm wrong but wasn't it confirmed in RE3 that Jill was the one who blew up the Tyrant? I believe it was a file or something.
Not in RE3 but according to the archives, Jill killed the tyrant
981

I realized the text is shitty, so I added Jill's Report #5
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Regarding the whole Wesker Thing - I think he has sworn to take a revenge on all living STARS members: Jill, Rebecca, Barry and Chris because they all foiled his plans. However, considering Chris was the only STARS member in CV, it's natural he'd say that he's salty over Chris. I don't think he needs to drop all names. It's never really specified whom he hated the most. In Wesker's Report he mentioned this:
Although I miscalculated and Chris and Jill harbored potential beyond my anticipation, the plan I advanced for Barry's betrayal proceeded smoothly. But the scheme deviated.
Also, originally Jill was part of CV until that got scratched

Many people think that Jill in RE5 was Wesker's way trying to get to Chris but actually Jill's fate in 5 was:
A) Luck, because of anti-bodies she had from RE3 when Nemesis infected her
B) Becoming his slave was his way to show his revenge against Jill.

Now the latter is the most ironic because Jill called him out in REmake and calling him "a Slave of Umbrella". Eventually, she became his slave in RE5. Coincidence? I think not.
There's many people who think that Capcom did Jill dirty because she didn't directly helped taking down Wesker in 5, after what he has done to her. And I agree with that sentiment.
 
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Captain Redfield

The man who killed Albert Wesker
Books have been wrong and obviously do not prevail over constructive plots and dialogue. Not to mention that those images are solely from Jill's story with Wesker getting slapped by the Tyrant and shot by Barry lol
That completely contradicts the canon of Wesker getting impaled to revive... Something he canonically retells in Umbrella Chronicles. Archives couldn't have been more wrong and I've seen countless other fans saying that they could've at least used canon images for those illustrations.
Therefore, Jill did not kill the Tyrant, but does not mean she didn't help Chris because I firmly believe they both fought it... Is a book going to prevail over CODE Veronica's dialogue? No. Over Wesker's canonical death in RE1? No. I think members like Newsbot and Batman stated the nonsense of archives going with those scenes so I'm not alone here.
Plus, Wesker doesn't say that just because Chris is the only STARS member in CV, he is clearly directing his vendetta towards Chris himself.
To further prove this there's the dialogue during Umbrella's End where Jill was there with Chris the whole time and not once Wesker even acknowledges her presence. Not saying that I enjoyed it but it is the truth.
Just look it up, Wesker doesn't even say Jill once... Yep, he was pissed at Chris just because he happened to be the only STARS member CV... Well, we all know that ain't true.

Even with in-game dialogue and a constructed plot arc between Chris and Wesker that clearly started because Chris messed up Wesker's plans in RE1 and yet people refuse to see the facts and always try to say Jill did this and that in RE1.

Another reason why I've grown tired of this community.
 
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mert20004

Mert_BIO_6
Chris, obviously. He has better knife skills capable of killing enemies in less than 10 slashes. He's better with firearms and you barely feel any recoil with him, particularly with the Magnum. Chris can also take more damage and insta-kill most enemies with the grenade.
Also, the Lab section with him fits the canon much better than Jill's, in Chris's ending Wesker gets impaled by the Tyrant as it is stated everywhere, whereas with Jill he gets slapped by the Tyrant and shot by Barry. As Wesker himself said in CODE: Veronica
"You have no idea how much I hate you... You destroyed my plans", this indicates that Chris clearly destroyed the Tyrant which was Wesker's offering to the Rival Company in exchange of a higher position from the get go and by destroying the Tyrant Chris screwed all of Wesker's plans that night... Well, along with Sergei as well haha

However, when doing my special RE1 playthrough I play as both because there is no RE1 with Chris and without Jill and vice-versa. Both characters should be played since they all have important info and scenes within them. It is just the Lab section that makes the most sense while playing as Chris and I usually ignore that section with Jill until the final battle and "imagine" both of them fighting the final boss with Chris blowing up the Tyrant.
I agree with this; sums up my thoughts why ı prefer chris over jill too.
 
Jill Valentine's. I prefer her storyline, her personality, and her interactions with other characters. She was vulnerable, but not weak (emotionally and physically), and had a calm collectedness. I loved the added depth to her experiences, such as Jill trying to save Joseph in the opening. None of her shots were being effective, and we can hear her trying to save him, as he's trying to save himself, until he runs out of rounds. Jill and Joseph weren't near the others, so Jill had the unique experience of seeing his death unfold firsthand. She became paralyzed in shock, seeing him being eaten alive, while STILL trying to fire her empty weapon. Hearing the clicking sound of her empty Samurai Edge, and then seeing the terror that comes upon her face, when the Cerberus turns around (snapping her out of her shock)...it just really set the tone for how much more realistic the remake would be over the original. This felt like something out of a genuine survivor horror theme.

I like the weapon options she has. I felt her having a stun gun was practical, and fit in line with her having other elemental damage with the grenade launcher. I actually really began to like it more, after Alyssa Ashcroft was given a stun gun in Outbreak file 2. I enjoy all the similarities they share.

I enjoy Jill is charming and compassionate, yet serious, and has no issue expressing her frustrations, questioning the actions of others, and demanding answers, all while still keeping her composure. I liked the way they established Jill's willingness to investigate on her own, and her reputation. For instance, Jill was willing to risk her life to go back outside for Chris, and didn't really care about the danger, because it was "Chris." Wesker specifically asks Jill to go, under the pretense that it might be Chris, rather than suggesting he's dead. Barry says he's going to go as well, because he and Chris go way back (he recruited Chris even). This tells us alot about the relationships between Jill/Chris/Barry already (a special connection that remains after this story).

Jill can be grateful Barry was around to save her from being crushed, and yet she still questions why he is where he is? Same with other instances. I like how Barry will offer Jill something "powerful", while he just hangs onto his trusty magnum. It shows that despite Jill being a woman, of a smaller stature than all the men on the team, she definitely is trusted to handle things. Same with having a lockpick given to her, it tells the player she's known to be useful with such a thing when it counts. Looking over her whole time in the series, you can come back to a moment like that, and notice the consistencies. Like Jill thanking Chris for a pulse grenade and grinning, or her telling Kirk, he sure knows how to treat a girl, when giving her the rocket launcher. Even Chris again in RE5, telling her she hasn't lost her touch with lockpicking, or bringing up her piano skills. It shows she's reliable, and people value her skills, without making a big deal about it. Though, I did miss Brad saying she was STARS Amazon from RE1.

Some may try to discredit Jill, because of the moments where she is/can be helped by others, but personally, I feel it enriches the storytelling. Characters have a little bit more action, usefulness and story. Take Richard for instance, he can be given a serum by Chris or Jill (Jill actually able to administer the shot herself and handle chemicals), but in Chris' campaign he just randomly pops up again, and then is killed right off. In Jill's story, Richard joins Jill against Yawn, talking about it's pay back time! He's not just assisting Jill, he's getting him some revenge! This was such a nice shift from how in RE1 he just dies regardless. It was nice to witness the comradery in combat, and him saving Jill felt more heroic, rather than come off like some cheap death. He was facing his fears, and fighting alongside his friend, vs just being another helpless victim who saves Chris, who Chris can blame himself over dying—eventhough he couldn't have done anything. Taking his assault shotgun then, I felt more attachment to its availability. Like you're carrying a piece of him with Jill. Honoring his courage and sacrifice. It carries a different tone from even using Forest's grenade launcher, because Richard was alive, and died having fought beside her.

I love how Jill can approach a scene, or look over Barry's shoulder and make him jump, or aim his weapon at her (esp given what happens later). It shows he's a bit jumpy, while she's a bit more together. It's nice to experience all the casual moments of genuine curiosity, and concern between them. You can tell they are close.

I love how after Chris saves Jill in the opening, the cerberus catch up, and when Chris was about to be attacked, he's saved by Wesker, but Jill stopped running when Chris did. You learn alot about her bond with Chris, without him even being present much. Likewise, her unwillingness to accept his death in the Jill/Barry ending is nice. She engaged with Barry about his family, happy for him (we even hear his OLDEST daughter especially was waiting up for him), but there's an unspoken sadness that Barry catches, and apologizes for going on about his family, given she clearly is thinking of Chris. This is echo'd in her RE3 epilogue, her diary, and by Chris in RE5. Jill never wants to believe Chris has died, and she shows concern about how he's dealing with things (giving him even more depth in the process). Rev1 has Parker completely aware of Jill's concern for Chris, while Chris, true to form, is very private about Jill. He doesn't open up to Rebecca, or tell Jessica about her, and doesn't really go into detail about Jill with Sheva either.

That said, I really enjoy the improvements to the whole betrayal story-line with Wesker and Barry in this version. Them making it impossible to have Barry with Jill, when Enrico is killed was a nice touch, as well as him abandoning her as she comes to back. She's left down there with Lisa. It gives Jill more of a reason to not trust Barry (there's no grabbing another rope for instance, she's literally watching him abandon her). I love how when she catches up to him. She is silent, and catches him off guard again. She approaches him slowly, as he lies to her face. She's furious, but she's not making an outburst. She's anticipating him trying to pull his weapon on her, and snatches it the moment he makes his move. She's mad, and only wants to hear the truth, else she shoot him wear he stands. This, all in spite of any times you can allow him to assist Jill. Lisa, the same person, he left Jill to fend for herself against, is now approaching them.

I Just LOVE everything about this segment in Jill's story. This isn't about a failed experiment, or taking a piece of the "action." This is a moment of truth for three victims of Wesker and Umbrella. Lisa was used and tortured in ways that were tragic and sad. She ended up being experimented on (I enjoy that something introduced in RE3 is being reflected in this game through her even), and living a tortured existence (again something Jill would later experience because of Wesker). This room is where her mother's body was left, along with her letter to Lisa from decades prior. She can finally find closure on her mom, even taking her skull with her. The only reason Barry went along with Wesker's plan was because he wanted to protect his family, and yet doesn't get have a chance to explain himself. Jill can refuse to give him any trust, which leads to him dying, unable to redeem himself. There is emphasis on Barry's death, by not only his magnum being left behind, but also his family photo.

I honestly like that Barry doesn't get to make it to the lab in this version of RE1. There is no asking for forgiveness, or final requests, and only Jill can witness it, it's just something unspoken, that Jill would have to deal with when she escapes. Interacting with the photo, will indicate that the photo fell out of his shirt, which to me symbolized he carried his family close to his heart, and the fact Wesker would control him by threatening their lives, even sadder. It reveals another twisted aspect of the kind of man Wesker is. Given Jessica Trevor and Barry both kept photos of their families with them, with their daughter's being left alive, the undertones, with all of that in mind, to me, it really gave this room such a richly dark atmosphere to it. On the flipside, Jill can choose to place some faith in Barry, which leads to him saving her from being shot. Jill can give Barry forgiveness, and we can see that it bothered him a great deal turning his back on his friends, even for his family. It made Barry coming back for Jill in RE3, and the e-mails in Rev2 have even more of an impact to me.

I enjoyed that either way you go, Wesker comments on the situation with Barry, and it pisses her off, on top of what he's done to STARS. I thought it was all very compelling. I loved watching the emotions brewing, and seeing what it was like for Jill to question people who's she's known for a couple of years, while also taking in the horrors she's seeing (she can even vomit after crushing a Zombie's skull). Still keeping her emotions together. Her anger is displayed differently from Chris.

Jill's confrontation with Wesker is entertaining. Jill doesn't question for how long he's been with UB, she just demands to know why STARS was eliminated. She shows such a great disgust over what he's done to Barry, the fact that what he did to Barry had nothing to do with UB's orders, and he was just using Barry for his personal purposes. Wesker, in one version of events will even outright tell Jill that he is actually moving on from Umbrella, and Jill demands to know what he's planning. He reveals the tyrant to her (thus revealing Tyrant is part of his plans).

I like that Wesker physically assaults Jill when she attacks his character verbally. She calls him a bastard for taking Barry's family hostage, he punches her in the face. When he reveals tyrant to her, she scoffs at him, saying it was all for the sake of this "thing" that he called magnificent. Sounding unimpressed. Wesker actually gets pissed off, and attempts to kill her before collecting any data. In her solo encounter, she says in a very scoffing manner, that he's like all the other things, a slave of umbrella, and he punches her stomach and face. I like that Jill is also particularly stunned by the fact that humans had been experimented on as well, and her comment about it all being for this thing, isn't delivered in an angry/mocking tone, but disbelief. Wesker finding out he was a human experiment himself, Jill becoming one of his personal human experiments, and Chris telling him he was just another Umbrella leftover, always takes me back to these moments with Jill and Wesker.

I do also like the unique twist in Jill's version where Wesker is impaled, in which Tyrant stabs him from behind. There's no surprised look on his face, it just happens as he looks at Jill. Literally "stabbed" in the back, by something he sought to control for his own gain (loaded irony), just like he backstabbed all of STARS. Unlike Chris, Jill doesn't call out his name, or start to run over to him. I felt like she probably never respected him as much as Chris may have. Knowing what happens to Jill as the series progressed, I just enjoy seeing a darker, more twisted side to him. He has no problem killing someone, but the stuff he does to Barry revealed more of his nature.

Regarding the whole Wesker Thing - I think he has sworn to take a revenge on all living STARS members: Jill, Rebecca, Barry and Chris because they all foiled his plans. However, considering Chris was the only STARS member in CV, it's natural he'd say that he's salty over Chris. I don't think he needs to drop all names. It's never really specified whom he hated the most.

I'm so glad you brought this up.

I've grown beyond tired of the nonsense I've seen come out of some in the fandom over the years. Tons of people who claim to know the lore and characters so well, and yet what comes out of their mouths/keyboards is often biased headcanons that ignore what's actually established officially, and sometimes skips rational logic. None of us know it all, but some folks take things way too far at times.

Like, I can't tell you how many times I've seen people trying to downplay Jill's story, her skills, etc. to prop up another character(s). I mean it's nothing exclusively done to her, and fans of any char (even Jill's) can be overbearing, but some really take it too far. Guess that's the nature of fandom though. Still, seeing utter crap about how Jill didn't really interact much with Wesker in RE1, or how Chris' story is supposedly more canon because Wesker always gets impaled in his version.

tenor.gif


Seriously, how the heck is Chris' story more canon, when Barry's role is quite literally, the most significant thing we get involving Wesker and his plans, and revealed even more about his character? Like seriously, did people even read/watch Wesker's CANON report I wonder at times. I've seen people try to bring up UC, and how Rebecca was in it, so that must mean Chris' story was more canon. UC, you know, an outsourced and rushed title, that completely omits Barry for obvious budget/time reasons, but still mentions him, and the fact he came to RC to save Jill, and survived the mansion.

Wesker's own words about his plans:

I miscalculated, Chris and Jill harbored potential beyond my expectations.
But the plan progressed smoothly due to Barry's "work."
Enrico would discover the truth, but wasn't much to take care of.
I disposed of that nuisance and awaited the arrival of the victims Barry would bring to me in the "Tyrant" lab.

From the most current version of his Report from the remastered REmake:

My biggest miscalculation in this plan was the "Tyrant" being defeated at the hands of S.T.A.R.S.
I lost my biggest bargaining chip and was forced to change the plan ahead.
I won't allow anyone to interfere with my plan.
It's been that way for a long time and will be for years to come. Eventually I will make the surviving S.T.A.R.S. pay the price.

alternative versions say:

By any means, I will corner S.T.A.R.S. and annihilate them.

So Wesker himself, BEFORE CV takes place, says STARS destroyed Tyrant, and says that he is going to eventually kill each of the STARS members. Where is his emphasis on Chris again?

source.gif


Let's say Jill wasn't booted from CV as the lead, and Wesker still got in, Wesker would've displayed his hatred toward Jill, based on the actual facts. Wesker never encounters Rebecca and Barry again, so they aren't ever a factor naturally. Wesker never actively sought out any of the STARS, so yes, I agree with the sentiment that the only reason Chris had any noted emphasis was because of CVX, which setup them having an inevitable fatal encounter.

I'll take a qoute from the kaitai shinsho book for Bio5:

UN UNMATCHED VILLAIN AGAINST CHRIS AND CO.
In the "Mansion Incident", he lured the S.T.A.R.S. officers into Umbrella's Arklay Laboratory, disguised as a mere mansion, targeting bioweapons and acquiring combat data, attempting to bring them together with B.O.W.'s to a different company. Because of Chris' success, this plan was derailed and he bore equal hatred of the S.T.A.R.S. survivors.

**Do note the book (translation) is not saying everything was a success because of Chris, thing are just written with him as the lead of RE5 in mind. Point here is that it's emphasized that Wesker's hatred was not more targeted on any single person from STARS. Jill is still credited for foiling Wesker's plans as well.

All this talk I've seen for years saying Chris is the 1st choice character, he narrates the intro, he had more focus shots in the endings, etc. Yeah, and STILL Jill's scenario was utilized more in Wesker's report, because it had the most involvement in Wesker's actual narrative. There was no one TRUE LEAD, or one "more canon" story. A mashup of both is canon, with Chris and Jill being the the ones who resolved everything. Even in Chris' profile in RE5, Chris AND Jill are both credited for defeating tyrant. One could discuss the footage used for Wesker's report, and you'll see alot for Jill's campaign, and Chris' will be used for the helipad fight, but neither would work in canon. Chris has to find out about Wesker's betrayal as he intended on all of the survivors to be present, and Jill is not NOT present, nor unconscious during the final fight. The real thing of significance here is that Wesker did not witness who killed tyrant. He was in the lab, and we later find out how he actually escaped in the Rebirth chapter in UC. So what is actually FACT is that he blamed all of STARS for ruining his plans. He said he underestimated Jill and Chris, and this would continue to be what led to his ultimate downfall.

Also, if we're REALLY gonna bring up the Chronicles series, then that's hilarious how Wesker and Chris don't even confront each other in the CV re-telling, and that's supposed to be a huge event. DC came out the same year as RE5 no less. How ironic is that? It's almost as hilarious as Chris, in RE6, saying it had been 3 years since he killed Wesker, when it had been over 4.

I mean if we really want to get technical, we got UC's novelization, the Archives, strategy guides, a comic from the 90s, etc all having Jill as the one who took out Tyrant. On top of that there's well:

collage.jpg

The fact that Jill is the only character who has consistently been associated with the original Rocket Launcher, even when depicted from later iterations, and cosplayed by other Capcom characters, I suppose I should be taking this as a sign from Capcom, that Jill killed Tyrant then? I mean that sure is a WHOLE lot of consistency for one character to have, but I understand they still do not ever say who got the final blow. Again, BOTH are credited for defeating it. Who knows, maybe the RE3 re-imagining will have a flashback or something giving clarity, but honestly it doesn't matter.

In CVX, we see Wesker contemplate the possibilities of what could happen upon seeing Claire. He didn't anticipate her being on the island, and he wasn't even looking for Chris at the time. Given the situation, now he knew he wouldn't have to, because Chris would come for Claire. He toyed with the idea of killing her, just to see Chris' reaction, but left her for the time being. When Wesker confronts Chris, he attacks him, taunts him, and then begins to choke the life out of him. Only thing stopping him was Alexia's behind giggling from one of the monitors. Wesker literally just tosses Chris aside like he got a new favorite toy to play with. Getting to her trumped him killing Chris. All that "hatred," and yet he was easily distracted by something of more importance to him at the time—which repeatedly happens in the series. Wesker has Steve's corpse transported, so he had time to kill, to get revenge on Chris. Instead of ending things quickly, he just flexed his power, Chris manages to use the environment to temporarily stop Wesker, and Wesker leaves due to the explosions. Chris dared to take him on alone, which Wesker even said he didn't know where Chris got his confidence from, and proceeded to beat him up, talking about the power he has gained.

At the end, Wesker told Chris it was his lucky day, and that the next time they met, he wouldn't have another one. Yet Wesker never went out of his way to confront Chris, or anyone else from STARS. It didn't suggest he forgot the promise that he would kill him though. Even in that prelude to the fall manga, he was more focused on what he came for, than an actual confrontation with Chris or Jill, he commented on Chris' "dumb luck" again, and also referred to when he left Chris to handle Alexia, by saying he'd leave him to handle the rest again. When Chris and Jill caught up to him again (Chris getting a grenade launcher at this point), Chris approaches Wesker as if he were about to stop him, if he didn't get some answers. Wesker tells them what he was there for, and what role the villiage had for UB, and then told Chris he could try to use his weapon if he wanted (daring him to try something). Bare in mind Chris was the one who attempted to initiate combat (with his gun) in CV. Before Chris could initiate any action, Anna steps in, and this ultimately ruined Wesker's plans further. When they all are approaching the chemical plant hiding the UB facility, Wesker comments on their fates being intertwined, and makes it clear that he plans on using an old friend/pawn to destroy a common enemy.

Bare in mind, UC was made when RE5 was already well into production, so of course Wesker would be emphasizing Chris more. As far as fans would know, Chris was the last one to confront him, but with CV not being represented in the game, there needed to be something that reflected that conflict. Wesker's narration was post CV, and thus, when Chris is relevant he was going to remember their confrontation. Keep in mind, when Chris was telling Jill they dealt a fatal blow to UB, Jill was the one focused on the fact Wesker was still out there. This showed this was their enemy.

In RE5, Chris initiates the combat between Chris, Jill, and Wesker. They show how powerful Wesker is, by causing both of them to drop their weapons, both need brief moments to recover from the impact of his blows. Chris was more aggressive, trying to rely on his physical strength, while Jill created distance with the rest of her bullets, and then attempts to use her knife. Wesker showed pleasure in choking the life out of both. For all we know, Wesker would've just killed Jill after killing Chris. We don't know. My point is, people talk about Wesker hating Chris more, but he didn't display any more hatred towards Chris there, than Jill. Wesker's own file in RE5, stated that Wesker thought it was a sign of what was next for him, that the two humans who interfered with his plans multiple times, had arrived when they did. This emphasizes again this wasn't just about Chris. Capcom's info states that the things that Wesker would do to Jill, was very personal towards her (not at Chris like some try to claim). It was revenge based, and frankly, it was the worst thing ever done to any of protagonists.


Bio5 Kaitai Shinsho:

That day, when she stepped into the mansion where the founder of Umbrella, Oswell E. Spencer, resided, she chose the route of death together with her rival. To save Chris, she leaped without hesitation, and fell down the cliff with her enemy. That was from a height where if you fall, there's no way you will survive.

The man who should have died with Jill, had gotten used to the virus that had changed his DNA, turning into a super human surpassing anyone's imagination. This man was Jill's superior during her S.T.A.R.S. period, as well as an Umbrella spy - Albert Wesker. With his superb reflexes and strength, he used the cliff to decrease the falling speed and survived, not forgetting to save Jill too. He carried her to his personal laboratory, stepping into the holy ground stained by darkness. Wesker's actions had one reason - He wished to give this lady, who resented him as much as Chris did, a taste of a suffering worse than death, by injecting the Uroboros Virus, which hadn't been completed yet, into her body.

Jill was placed in a long cyrogenic sleep in a low temperature chamber for the virus to take effect. This greatly changed her fate of heading into the direction of destruction though. The t-Virus which went dormant during the treatment she received in the "Raccoon City Destruction" incident, had been awakened due to her extended cyrogenic sleep.

Wesker discovered it, and he extracted the antibodies. He used it to control the poison in the Uroboros Virus, which uses the Progenitor Virus as its basis. Ironically, the antibodies from Jill's body have accelerated the completion of the Uroboros Virus.

Jill, with her antibodies, has been administered P30 - Gifted with superhuman abilities, she has been given a strong drug which controls her mind too. This evil drug has been continuously injected into her body, and torturing her to no end. Just like Wesker's intention, Jill is getting a hell-like suffering.


.......

Unknown chemicals are injected into her body continuously, some makes her heart pump excitedly, others made her feel as if she's at the calm before death... some make her feel confused. These medicines will not only cause people to have illusions, enhanced nerve sensory, but also false feelings where they will treat a second as a few minutes. Her spirit is being played with, her body continuously being tortured. For the TRICELL scientists who have long abandoned human sense, she's not a human, but a toy identified as Test Subject 0084-6237.

But someone is hating the fact that her personality is getting wiped away. This man is the mastermind behind this human experiment, and he's not simply just viewing her as an experimental subject. Besides a target for studying, he also used a special kind of drug to control her, and treated her as his loyal right hand man. For this to happen to her, who have felt tired fighting against the evil plan, this is an insult to the justice in her.

Again, "Wesker hates Chris more," which is never actually stated anywhere in the lore, and yet, Capcom's own material is telling us, Wesker CHOSE to save Jill, because he was ready to begin enacting his revenge on her. He was about to kill Chris, and she stopped that, and now his focus was still on his bigger plans, but not without making Jill pay for screwing up his plans as well. He threatened to kill Chris multiple times, and yet here it's saying Wesker wanted to give Jill a SUFFERING WORSE than death. Living up to what HE told us himself, he would make anyone who got in his way PAY. All this talk about rivalry, and yet this is saying Wesker is her rival, and her enemy too.

Even MVC3 showcased this difference. Wesker only cared about killing Chris, and let him know he wouldn't live to see him take over as a God, but with Jill he taunts her by saying she'd be under his control forever.

From Jill's profile in Bio5:

When the "Uroboros Project" was completed, he planned to use her as the first test subject.
This was Wesker's modest revenge.

Jill continued being kept alive as a living factory for the anti-bodies.
She, who hated bioterrorism more than anyone else and had prevented many sinister schemes, was going to be used for the worst plot. She wasn't free from irony.

Then the Uroboros Virus was completed.
Jill became unnecessary, but was unsuitable as a test subject for the Uroboros Virus.
Her body was full of virus antibodies with high purity.
Therefore, Wesker decided to use her for something else.

I qoute this to point out that Wesker literally took all of Jill's experiences and her luck, and flipped it all against her. Her efforts to stop UB, surviving RC and infection, saving Chris. He was going to make her be the very thing she said he was in the beginning, a SLAVE! He didn't need to keep her around, but did so, just to experiment on her, control her, and make her do everything that was an injustice to her, all while having her completely aware of what he was making her do, and what her survival allowed to happen. Jill doesn't tell Chris all the heavy stuff for why he needed to leave her behind, but one can imagine Jill probably thought of how the world would've been ruined by Wesker, and she would've be part of why he was successful.


After being released from the laboratory facility, she was given a suit which allows her to execute missions in secret. A mask which makes people think of a night hunting animal, as well as a dark cloak which covers the body that didn't get degenerated, but further enhanced during to the long term training in the prison - assuming an underground mystery identity, she is now a subordinate of a terrorist. She appears actively in the dark corners of the streets, striking fear and leaving a trail of disaster wherever she goes.

This right here is all capturing what is the subtext of RE5. The very things that Jun Takeuchi was stating about how Jill's role was what would make people question if this was REALLY an RE game. She was tied to every aspect of the game, the partner system, Chris' story, etc. She was the centerpiece of it all. Jill was left isolated from her friends, she had no reason to believe anyone would believe she alive (heck Wesker was presumed dead, even by Chris). She had chosen death to protect someone, only to find herself surrounded by people who did not see her as a human, but a "thing." Some experiment or toy. The drugs were making her suffer like no other protagonist has ever had to experience. Her appearance changed, she was made responsible for what killed her affiliates and other innocent people. Literally the FIRST thing we see in this game, is Jill having infected a man with Uroboros....the virus that SHE was used to complete. Her allies, being setup to be killed as a result. All of this, because she had opted to try and kill herself with Wesker for Chris. No goodbyes there. She once feared what it meant for her to become infected, was saved, and now all of this happens to her? That's pure hell.

I feel like people get so caught up on all the action, that they don't pay attention to the dark story Jill had. Jill is around Chris multiple times in the game. She cannot control her actions, and Chris cannot see it's her. She even finds out that Chris is only around because he's been trying to find her. He's asking for her, when she's right there, and she has to stand there with no ability to reveal herself. That is hell. Wesker reveals himself, and allows Jill to be revealed (she HID her face when the mask was shot off!), before continuing to have Jill fight Chris. Her orders were to kill Chris. She resisted, and then Wesker decided to overdose her (which Jill had Chris do to Wesker in return). Wesker eventually realized, he continued to underestimate both of them, always feeling like they were inferior beings. He put Jill through a physical and psychological hell, and tried his best to physically end Chris. Sure Wesker screamed Chris' name at the end, but in truth, I think that all goes back to him regretting not killing Chris years, ago as he said. Chris never would've found him, or stopped his plans, if he had've just killed Jill after uroboros was complete. He underestimated their bond, and their willpower.

A shame, seeing people over the years, argue over who is better, who Wesker hates the most, who's the best etc. cause in truth I feel Chris and Jill are both the best. BOTH have a rich history with major things that take place in the series. They symbolize the unrelenting will of those who choose to fight back at injustice by choice. They were both used in RE1, which made everything involving UB personal for both, they weren't just involved by random chance. It's one reason why I love Jill's opening monologue in RE3. Chris built himself up to take on Wesker, and instead of retiring, dared to face his fear of losing people on the field. He left his comfort zone with Jill. Sheva was a sign of the kind of people who were needed to follow in their footsteps. Jill is the one we got to witness a whole life being taken away from (TWICE), direct attempts at her life from UB, infection happening after her initial means of escape was destroyed, all before seeing her town (the town she was a protector of) be wiped off the map. When clouds of hopelessness, were removed she came back swinging against everything thrown at her. She goes through hell and back to make sure Wesker was killed. She gave her knowledge, and the orders to kill him. I swear, eventhough RE5's ending was from Chris' POV mostly, there is a satisfaction I find, in seeing Chris staring at Jill at the end, and for once, both are able to smile over the outcome.
 
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Captain Redfield

The man who killed Albert Wesker
Jill's scenario was utilized more in Wesker's Report doesn't make it more canon because Wesker's death in there is not how it happened nor how it was depicted in Umbrella Chronicles or anything prior to it. Just walls of text trying to prove how Jill's story is the "superior one" over Chris's but none actually saying how important Chris's story also is and mostly how it was pivotal in the biggest rivalry in the series.

People often try to play sides with their favorite character, I get it. I do it myself usually when it is just brainless discussions, we all have our moments. But when it comes to RE1 saying that Chris's story isn't this and that Jill did this and that is utterly pointless and contradicts canon key points.
Anyway, feel free to believe in fairytales.
 
Jill's scenario was utilized more in Wesker's Report doesn't make it more canon because Wesker's death in there is not how it happened nor how it was depicted in Umbrella Chronicles or anything prior to it. Just walls of text trying to prove how Jill's story is the "superior one" over Chris's but none actually saying how important Chris's story also is and mostly how it was pivotal in the biggest rivalry in the series.

People often try to play sides with their favorite character, I get it. I do it myself usually when it is just brainless discussions, we all have our moments. But when it comes to RE1 saying that Chris's story isn't this and that Jill did this and that is utterly pointless and contradicts canon key points.
Anyway, feel free to believe in fairytales.

Did I say Jill's story was more canon? No. I said what is canon is a mesh up of BOTH scenarios. I point out people cannot say Chris' story is more canon, when Barry's betrayal, and bringing the survivors to the lab, is a major part of Wesker's story, as told by the man himself. Her story revealed more about what was going on with him. That is not the same as saying her story is more canon. Comprehension is key! You can talk about how Wesker gets impaled any kind of which way you want, that doesn't change anything I said. Tyrant impales Wesker the same in Jill's bad version of events in RE1. Point is him being near death from Tyrant's attack is canon. Like I said without everyone being present, there is no canon depiction of events.

Oh what I have to say is just walls of text, huh? Oh, I'm so offended. My points still stand.

First of all, just like you gave your OPINION, on why you prefer Chris's gameplay and story. I simply stated why I preferred Jill's campaign. None of it had anything to do with it being better. I simply state what I liked about it, and why it is my preferred campaign. Don't like it? Not my problem, but do not get my words twisted.

Unlike you, I don't go off on a tangent, projecting my own thoughts about how someone's campaign is the more authentic version of events. I don't say Jill is the one who Killed Tyrant, and then provide a quote that doesn't actually indicate that she is the one, and only one, who killed it, as if it's basically confirmed. I do however state that Wesker did not even see who killed Tyrant. I DO state that Chris and Jill were both credited in Chris's file in RE5, as being the ones who killed it.

I showed how, consistently, Jill is the one most associated with the rocket launcher used to kill Tyrant, as a means of illustrating Capcom has repeatedly had no issue associating Jill with Tyrant's defeat, and even what we're led to believe killed it. What do I say at the end of it? That both are credited for killing the thing, and that in the end it doesn't matter who took the final blow. There is nothing stating clearly Chris killed it, as fact, when Capcom's words credit he and Jill both did it. Bottomline.

As I said, before CV takes place, Wesker says STARS took out his creation, and he would eventually wipe them out/make them pay, which is all his dialogue indicates in CV. I also point out that Wesker was not actively looking for any of them, but it is fact, that he was keeping tabs on everything. He credits Leon and Claire for killing Birkin, and even was aware of Jill being confronted by Nemesis. He listened to Chris and Jill's discussion as they all approached the chemical plant. He said he would get rid of anyone that got in his way, and that's how he's always been. He's saying he believed that should anyone get in the way of his plans again, he would take them out...that included STARS. Like I also said, if Jill hadn't of been booted from her role in CV, and Wesker still got in, there's no reason to doubt he would've expressed his hatred and desire to kill her as well, because of what Wesker said about STARS. Just because Chris happened to be the first one he encountered, doesn't mean everything fell on Chris, nor that Chris was the one he hated the most.

Even in RE4, early on he wanted Leon eliminated, just because he felt he could be a potential problem for his plans. He knew all about him. He confronted Sergei and took him out, as well. He killed Spencer, and proclaimed the right to become a god was his. When Chris and Jill confront him, he was going to kill both of them. It was highlighted as a key moment for Wesker's realization of his direction. Chris and Jill showing up was a sign, that they would always be a problem. They needed to be eliminated. Jill became a "non-threat" after her sacrifice, and he chose to experiment on her. Chris was a non-threat as well, but Wesker didn't understand Chris and Jill's bond was powerful. Chris was secretly doing everything he could to find Jill (he told no one), and found a leak mentioning her name. This is literally what leads to his demise, not just this idea that Chris was Wesker's one and only rival. It was Chris and Jill still. THAT, if you grasped what I said, is what I was talking about. I'll take Wesker's words and overall actions, over anyone's interpretation of one line, any day.

You're the one out here claiming:
this indicates that Chris clearly destroyed the Tyrant which was Wesker's offering to the Rival Company in exchange of a higher position from the get go and by destroying the Tyrant Chris screwed all of Wesker's plans that night... Well, along with Sergei as well haha

Capcom says repeatedly, Chris and Jill kill tyrant, and foiled Wesker's plans, but here you're saying Chris and Sergei are the ones who screwed everything up. That is false.

That said, I'm not interested in fairytales, nor believing that they are real.
 
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Captain Redfield

The man who killed Albert Wesker
Just because Chris happened to be the first one he encountered, doesn't mean everything fell on Chris, nor that Chris was the one he hated the most.

Ohh, but he is the one Wesker hates the most. You're kidding yourself if you think otherwise. That's why both of them were archenemies... Wesker also clearly states that he came for Alexia but killing Chris was even better, he held a grudge against STARS in general? Sure. But if you think Chris wasn't the driving force in the Mansion Incident, which in turn made Wesker have a personal vendetta against Chris then you're purely in denial.

Unlike you, I don't go off on a tangent, projecting my own thoughts about how someone's campaign is the more authentic

Sure, that's why you said this in the comment before "Do note the book (translation) is not saying everything was a success because of Chris, thing are just written with him as the lead of RE5 in mind." The book even states that Chris was the driving force behind the failure of Wesker's plans in the Mansion Incident and you came up with the excuse of Chris's name solely being used because he was the lead of RE5... Just trying to mold the context of things to better fit your own view.
The book states he equally hated S.T.A.R.S. but the fact Chris is mentioned by name is a clear indication of who truly was at the forefront of screwing up Wesker. Numerous canon and IN-GAME facts corroborate with this instead of some illustrations in Archives depicting a non-canon event.
I really don't have much to discuss here, all we have to do is play the damn story lol
 
Wesker also clearly states that he came for Alexia but killing Chris was even better,

Wesker literally ignored Chris, when he was still wanting to get a sample from Alexia. He literally started to kill him, and ignored him entirely when he saw Alexia on the monitor. When he realized he couldn't get a sample from Alexia, he fled, and had Steve's corpse taken away. That's why when Chris replied to Wesker's statement about how killing Chris would be even better, saying he's sorry to disappoint, but Alexia was dead, Wesker replied it was no longer a concern, because he had Steve's corpse. He got what he needed, and had time to kill getting revenge.

The book states he equally hated S.T.A.R.S. but the fact Chris is mentioned by name is a clear indication of who truly was at the forefront of screwing up Wesker. Numerous canon and IN-GAME facts corroborate with this instead of some illustrations in Archives depicting a non-canon event.

Actually no, you see, as I said, the book wrote things with Chris in mind as the lead. If you actually looked at the source material, you would've notice Jill is not mentioned in those character profiles, until later—though there is one about a hooded figure after Sheva. It's why Chris is the first character discussed in the book, you know because he's the lead. His portion mentions nothing about Jill or anyone else. There's a mention of him seeking information, but it doesn't mention that the information he's seeking is about Jill. It says he formed an Anti-Umbrella unit, but doesn't mention the fact that Jill formed that with him, yet it's mentioned later (only after her name was dropped in Wesker's profile), that it was Chris and Jill's unit. So there is a specific flow of information, hence why I said what I did. Again, do not get my words twisted.

Based on what's available, Jill's section was the last one, there's just no translation posted on the site I got it from. I stated this very book itself declares, Jill and Chris are BOTH credited for ruining Wesker's plans (just like Chris's profile you unlock in RE5). Thus it was their success that ruined his plans. So no, I'm not trying to fit anything to my own view, just stating the actual facts. The fact is Jill and Chris both ruined his plans. The book plainly states that Wesker is Jill's rival and enemy, which means, Wesker would be her 'archenemy' all the same as Chris. This is what is stated, and THIS is what is actually canon.

I already addressed the in-game stuff (including the fact Wesker does not witness who killed Tyrant), and didn't actually focus on the archives myself. I did point out the background things that made it abundantly clear, that Wesker did the worst to Jill, and it was his personal form of revenge against her, which means Chris is not his only strongly hated enemy. He didn't simply want her dead anymore. He repeatedly found more ways to cause an injustice to her, and make her existence hell for her, while also using her to further his plans. Just because Jill wasn't allowed to physically confront him again, doesn't mean he didn't view her as a prime enemy as well. Even after she was freed from his control, she still had waves of enemies trying to kill her, and prevent her escape. Her communication was cut off from Chris right after she delivered the info Chris used to poison Wesker. More endless waves of enemies were sent after her, and attempted to stop her from escaping. I know this, because I played the "damn story."

It wasn't Excella who pulled those strings, as she was betrayed and killed at that point. This shows Jill was indeed a prime target of Wesker's as well. This is very similar to Carla and Simmons' attacks against each other. Neither directly confronted each other, but both knew who was trying to stop the other, and attempting to ruin their plans. As if Wesker wouldn't realize Jill must've told Chris about his serum. It was her own theory that overdosing him would cause a poisonous reaction. She made it clear that she knew about why Wesker got his injections, and the purpose they served. Chris and Sheva wouldn't have known what to do with the serum otherwise. He didn't need to say Jill's name, as he was desperate to launch Uroboros at this point, and Chris and Sheva were there to stop him. This is why Wesker expressed his regret for not killing Chris years ago. He always underestimated him, and likewise Jill.

Like I said, Wesker's profile stated that he thought it was no coincidence Chris and Jill both showed up when they did in RE5, and he would've killed both of them, as both are the credited "inferior" beings/constants who always got in the way of his plans. There is no beating around the bush on that.
 

mert20004

Mert_BIO_6
Sorry for the late reply but ı need to add something.

Something that's very important and seems to be glossed over by many people.

Objectively chris' run is much better than jill's, especially storywise. I can easily explain it why.

Jill's scenario doesnt mention rebecca. She's nowhere to be seen.

At least chris' scenario mentions barry despite him not being present but jill's scenario doesnt even take rebecca into account.

I just dont like that. Rebecca and richard are like in a sister-brother kind of relationship and in jill's run, she's completely ignored.

Mikami did a disservice to iwao as well as re1 by not hiring a writer for the game too. It still has parallel scenarios even though re2 improved the scenarios when compared to re1.

I also dont like how richard isnt taken into a saveroom in jill's run. He appears when you encounter yawn and if you stick around and let richard damage the monster, he gets eaten anyway. If you take the mask and leave; he dies off-screen while screaming. I just cant stand that. During my marathon; ı didnt even bring him the serum with jill. I brought it to him when playing as chris but ı didnt want to do it when playing as jill. Cause rebecca wasnt present.

In chris' run; richard gets taken into a saveroom if you bring him serum in time. There are even special cutscenes that shows chris being worried about him. It makes his sacrifice in chris' run much more tragic, especially when compared to his sacrifice in jill's run which is more contrived.

I just dont like remake as much as ı used to personally. I prefer re2 and re6 over it.

I checked true blue stars' long replies again and he doesnt even mention this for some weird reason.

Criticising re6 for ignoring jill ( Even though they planned to mention her with extra canon story additions for the game, after all she's mentioned in guidebooks. But no; capcom had to ruin the game's potential with rerev2 thanks to those survival horror fans who know nothing about the franchise. ) is fine but apparently ı cant criticise remake for this?

Looking back; ı'm not surprised why they made chris fight iluzija without jill too. Biohazard the stage also has rebecca without jill.
 
If you think about RE (1996) and even Remake in terms of canon that complete story of that arklay mansion incident is a big mystery...
While the usual answer to it is considering a mix of the two campaigns once Umbrella Chronicles retellings by Wesker (yes UC is basically telling most of the stories from Albert Wesker point of view so it definitely should be about how he remembers it...
While at first I thought UC was supposed to give an answer to this it made it even more strange with the complete omission of Barry...
Since for Wesker plans the details about Barry are such an integral part of his story there (maybe he just ignores that part and prefers to talk about Chris and Jill but that's really inconsistent).

So all these games that deal with the mansion incident have endings incompatible with what the lore states...

The canon tells us these 4 that were inside the mansion survived: Chris, Jill, Barry and Rebecca... I am discounting Brad and Wesker (even though they actually survive beyond that incident mainly because

1) brad is actually just assisting as helicopter pilot and never left it,.

plus 2) Wesker was considered dead at that moment and was not rescued by the chopper.

and finally 3) I am talking about the people that we're more significante for the final scene and that went there into Arklay forest and the mansion and engaged in full combat with the bows then left via the chopper.

But instead of creating another game or a remake of Remake what I think they should do is a complete CGI movie that is canon and tells the whole story and finally 100% consistent that would also clear up any oddity surrounding who did x to y in order to reveal a more streamlined path.

It would be actually a nice compliment to fans and I feel easier to do than a live action movie, plus they could release a RE Origins CGI movie during one the series anniversaries to serve as a token of gratitude and provide long time fans something with lasting appeal.
 

mert20004

Mert_BIO_6
It's cause of mikami. He doesnt care about storyline or characters that much. If he was; he would have hired writers for remake and re4. His opinion on rebecca is also lame.

About chronicles retelling for remake; you might be able to excuse it by saying that wesker wanted to keep barry a secret since he was doing his bidding and umbrella chronicles' retellings are told by wesker. He doesnt have to be %100 accurate with what he says.

I still think umbrella chronicles' retellings are disappointing though.
 
I typically play this game with my wife and we take turns. No preference really. It's not as good as the original in my opinion but it's still good.
 
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