The way you demonize "socialism" with such fervor is astounding. Sweeping generalizations ahoy. Universal health care is a very basic right that the U.S. should have provided decades ago, and has only dug itself into a hole with the more it puts it off. "Obamacare" is a step in the right direction one way or another.

One problem is that the U.S. must either sacrifice the quality for life of its citizens, or sacrifice its ability to lower the quality of life for others.

Oh you mean those Occupy Wall Street morons?


Oh typical far-left talk. No one was "demonizing" anything, but of course I'm sure that just makes me and anyone else who supports liberty a "racist", isn't that your favorite buzzword? Since when is socialist health care a basic right? I don't buy your food, I don't pay your rent, I don't buy any amenities for you, so why should I pay your medical bills for you?

Why should the quality of my health and the health care of other hard working Americans go down because some socialist European dictator feels he can tell us how to run our country? Americans don't want socialism and we certainly don't want Obamacare. Our country, our culture, our way of life, the very fabric of our being is based on personal responsibility and small government. It's the American way of life, it always has been, and always will be. We don't need hand-outs from some European dictator who thinks he knows how to live our lives better than we do.

Who brought up race? Caucasian Americans are just Europeans. "Racist" is not my buzzword as I have never even used it in any discussion with you. "Socialist" and "European dictatorship" are your buzzwords on the other hand.

It's not "socialist health care". It's universal health care. You don't pay medical bills. There are no medical bills in universal health care. You pay taxes. The government decides what to do with those taxes. Funding an actual health care program to stop its citizens from dying from otherwise easily treatable ailments just because they can't run an economy worth a fuck is not a bad thing. Likewise, most Americans would rather like to not be forced to spend extortionist amounts of money for a few check-ups.

Nobody is talking about hand-outs from "some European dictator" (is Canada a dictatorship too with its socialist health care?). Just that the U.S. should get its own act together and actually provide health care to people who aren't going to be able to afford a $5000 series of treatments that are commonplace and not a problem in most of the rest of the world. There's also the little fact that, you know, universal health care automatically leads to an increase in the health of the population, which is better for any country out of sheer default. Your country's quality of health is already in the toilet. I think you might want to step back and take a look. Thus, universal health care is absolutely necessary before the U.S. sees any improvement in its average quality of health. Because, you know, this is what the reality is:



To add to this, the U.S. spends more on health care than most other nations. But is inferior. They waste money on an inefficient service which is pretty much the worst in the world for a developed nation.

Man, these European dictators aren't such bad people after all. At least people have a chance of surviving under their leftist regime. There is no "American way of life". But this just looks like another nonsense buzzword from you to describe your fantasies. Though if your way of life involves poverty or death because you couldn't afford a surgery, I'd say you're in luck. Because that's exactly what America is. Your goofy patriotism and Euro-skeptic nonsense (most of which is grounded in reality, every system has inherent flaws and problems, but you take it to the Moon with fringe lunatic accusations of dictatorship and demonic socialism) are misinformed and, frankly, wrong.

Most of your pathetic gobblecock is merely the result of ignorance. Maybe you should do some reading on what universal health care is. Probably won't stop those stars and stripes you have for eyes from being blind, though. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Universal_health_care

You know, News Bot is absolutely right. I have no reason to state an opinion on health care as he said it right. Also, Ron Paul is a step in the right direction as well.

All of Ununoctium's posts can be summed up quite easily.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SbmxqfGkg1Q[/youtube]

He does know, dude. He's not ignorant on this. I know this because I spent what must have amounted to whole hours of my life educating him. I'm surprised you didn't see some of the...discussions...I had with him over at THIA before Carn got fed up with him causing problems, but some of them are quite funny.

Here's a few highlights;
http://www.the-horror.com/forums/showth ... quot-Riots - Where we're told why rich people should never pay more tax than the poor, that socialist health care can never work and that anyone can be rich in America, ignoring they need money to start with.

http://www.the-horror.com/forums/showth ... endum-2011 - Where UK members done get told about how there political system works, that UKIP is the party most of the UK supports and merrily accuses me of racism.

http://www.the-horror.com/forums/showth ... elers-here - Where he yells at gypsies, only to find out that they're doing exactly what he suggested.

http://www.the-horror.com/forums/showth ... ur-Freedom - Where we find out he has no idea about history, that guns do kill people...and that he has no actual idea of how either the American or European political systems work. Also, how to irritate Carnival.

Not including such magic moments as using his uncle's (apparently terminal) illness to tell us how awesome the American Healthcare system, something even he decided wasn't cool after people telling him a bunch and acting really, really creepy towards a 16 year old female member.

Yeah, we established a long time ago that Ununoctium never has any idea about anything ever and will make up any old shit to squeeze in some Euro-hating USA-loving nonsense at any opportunity. It's just common courtesy to rub his face in the fact.

Also, another highlight for your list, where he thinks the English language came from America:
viewtopic.php?p=106498#p106498

...owwww, you sod! You made me laugh my funny bone out of my damned body!

I love the Two stupid dogs-reference, Bot. :P

Anyway, you Americans who despise the idea of universal health care, talk to me from your graves when I outlived you because I didn't have to pay a lot of money for a medical problem that was ridiculously easy to solve.

Ununoctium, No offence, but you sound like a damn fool. Way to buy into the bile that these money grubbing insurance companies have been feeding America for years. It baffles me how any reasonable person could oppose Universal Health care... it means people, ALL people, will live healthier lives, won't have to ever fear going fucking bankrupt just because they break a bone, or get cancer...

It's pea brained sheep like you that let these evil insurance companies get away with highway robbery. Mean while, the rest of the civilized world is laughing at our inefficient, archaic, JOKE of a healthcare system.